Montpelier 5/20/2012
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  1. Thanks Richard. Nice piece. Curious if IBM reads it. Of course, another factor is how many part time employees does IBM have, those working in jobs that are not classified as full time and no benefits? Those people, if lucky, might have Catamount, so we are paying for them, whereas IBM is not.

  2. Mr. Davis,

    Companies like IBM become successful through a massively complicated process of evaluating every facet of their operations in order to optimize them; they cut waste and add value anywhere possible, because the aggregate of small and medium-sized changes – if done correctly – will add up to a competitive advantage.

    What you’re suggesting is that because a company has been successful at this, it should abandon part of what has made it successful because it would be “good for the entire state and not just for IBM.”

    No company EVER becomes successful because it does what is good for the state instead of what is good for itself.

    Companies exist to provide products or services. If they’re good at this, they make a profit, invest capital, own property, pay employees, provide employee benefits, and give back to communities in ways they feel are appropriate… all of which generate prosperity, as well as tax revenue for the state. That’s how companies benefit the state – by being successful and earning PROFIT, not by behaving as though they are a giant ATM for the governor’s and the legislature’s grand plans.

    1. “No company EVER becomes successful because it does what is good for the state instead of what is good for itself.”

      Thank you for so eloquently making the argument that corporate charters should go back to being temporary. Do some good and you can be incorporated. Thumb your nose at an entire state and lose that ability.

    2. It’s pretty clear that IBM has no intention of giving back to the community, since they’re actively working to avoid it by threatening a pull-out. Does this sound like a company that when given the choice, would voluntarily part with a small portion of it’s enormous profits in the interest of benefiting the community? That’s a rhetorical question by the way.

      Please, explain to us again what the difference is between coercion and voluntarism, and why one is better for the community than the other. Also please explain to us how one day IBM will collectively wake up and think “We’ve made too much profit this year, why don’t we give some of this money away in the interest of benefiting the community we reside in”.

      I mean really, who could possibly imagine the CEO of IBM doing something like… oh I dunno, giving himself a 30% raise:

      http://www.networkworld.com/news/2011/030811-ibm-palmisano-compensation.html

      We should just have a little faith, and believe that all he really wants to do is give back to the community that made it possible for him. That’s sarcasm by the way.

      1. Mr. Davis,

        It seems to me that you misunderstand the basic purpose of businesses. The reason they exist is not to benefit the community by directly transferring cash, but rather to provide their products and/or services well.

        And, cry out against executive compensation packages all you want, but the fact remains that making a company successful is incredibly difficult, and the people who know how to do that are sought-after commodities. Boards of directors are willing to pay huge money to find folks who can chart and achieve strategic success for a business, because there aren’t that many of them out there. And by the way, boards of directors generally give CEOs raises; any CEO who tried to give herself a 30% raise unilaterally would only end up forced out of her position.

        Your rhetoric seems to be predicated on the notion that profits and high pay are wicked things, and that any company that is highly profitable should make amends by transferring cash to the communities in which it does business. This ignores the fact that highly profitable businesses are able to pay employees better, provide better benefits, and conduct more voluntary CSR activities. These are values that are shared by liberals and conservatives alike, but you seem intent on using a company’s success as a lever to pry yet more cash from it.

        It should be no surprise that such companies look around them at the dozens of states courting businesses (to say nothing of foreign countries), and decide that they don’t need to put up with being treated like a bad neighbor simply for being successful.

  3. Great piece, Richard.

    Jamal – I can’t disagree with you more. Vermont Businesses for Social Responsibility believe our local companies and businesses have a responsibility beyond their financial bottom line.

    1. Mr. Barlow,

      There are many, many companies that believe in being responsible to the communities in which they do business, and they do so voluntarily to the tune of billions of dollars a year. In fact, there is an entire industry sector emerging that helps companies find the best ways to maximize their impact in this realm. However, I think there is a fundamental difference between voluntary socially responsible behavior and coerced behavior deemed “socially responsible” by others.

      Unfortunately, VBSR doesn’t simply advocate that your members behave in certain ways; you actually advocate that the legislature force other businesses, by law, to behave in ways YOU find “responsible.”

      It’s nice that you believe companies have a responsibility beyond their financial bottom line, but in my view, it’s not so nice that you believe it so strongly that you want everyone else to fund your policy preferences through tax dollars and the force of law. If a business is indeed socially “irresponsible,” then I would think the caring citizens and consumers would vote with their dollars not to support such an entity.

  4. Mr. Kheiry seems to feel that a company has no business to do what is right for the people it “lives” in the midst of. He also appears to think that a company profits independently of its employees; that it is the company that provides prosperity rather than something that comes about as a result of the work of the people that do the work as employees of the company. If the company didn’t provide benefits who would be willing to work for them? The company certainly should pay its fair share of taxes, yet some other well known corporations report up to billions in profits yet pay no taxes. The point being that the company may not feel it appropriate to “give back” to the communties as it would adversely affect the “bottom line”. I don’t believe Mr. Davis is suggesting that IBM should be a giant ATM for the governor’s and legislature’s grand plans; rather that IBM has been interfering with what the people of the state of Vermont are saying through the democratic process that they want and need. Sorry if that doesn’t generate still more profit for IBM, but isn’t it a little miserly to ignore the will of (and benefits to) the people where it does business? I think IBM would benefit from a “can do” approach to working for the mutual benefit of itself and society. I think that comes under good Public Relations, no?

    1. Mr. Coates,

      Your interpretation of my comments is incorrect; I believe companies DO have an obligation to do good in the communities where they do business. However, I believe this should be voluntary, and I’m happy to reward businesses that behave this way by being their customer. Similarly, I have no trouble withholding my custom from entities that behave irresponsibly. But there is a huge difference between voluntary contributions and forced contributions.

      At the same time, you mis-characterize my views when you suggest that I think companies profit independently of their employees’ work. Obviously, a company does well only if its employees perform. However, the company pays employees money and benefits to perform, and many of them also offer profit-sharing and other performance-based incentives. If a company prospers as a result, it’s getting what it has paid for, and the employees are getting compensated for their labor; there’s recognition on both sides of the equation that everyone’s getting what they bargained for.

  5. I would be willing to sit down with Jamal and Walter and Arthur and work out our differences over a couple of beers and some Rick Astley.

  6. It is disingenuous to compare IBM’s worldwide corporate profit to the cost of a Vermont-only change; fairer, IMO, to consider the profit generated in VT itself. Hard to know how much profit really comes from VT, but to get a sense of proportion, perhaps use employee count: IBM has 426, 751 employees (2010 SEC 10-K), and (according to various press releases and blogs) employs about 5000 people in VT – that’s about 1.2%. So maybe compare teh cost of teh health-care change to $50M in VT-base profits, rather than to $4.8B in worldwide profits … it’s more fair to the other people who want a piece of IBM’s profit stream for their local betterment.

  7. There’s really nothing to get worked up about here. The State of Vermont is a service provider – it allows business to be conducted on the land it administers for certain fees. If IBM finds a more efficient service provider in this or another country it weigh transitioning costs and potentially switch to that one. It’s really a maximization exercise for Vermont, balancing political viability with (per-business income x quantity of operating businesses).

  8. Maybe we need to see if IBM is evading taxes. IBM sells a program for this. I hope our government isn’t using it.

    Closing the Tax Gap: IBM’s New Business Analytics Offering for Smarter Tax Collections (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGKp13APsBg)

  9. If the legislation passes then IBM should just bail out of Vermont and put the jobs elsewhere. Leave the liberals and entitlement minded to figure out how to pay the tab by themselves. That’s the beauty of globalization, those who create the wealth no longer have to deal with those who leech off of it.

    Just like when people buy that made in china cheapo product at big box mart instead of paying a bit more for made in the usa. Anyone who does is doing the same thing as IBM and other global companies, you are saying “I’m putting my money where the costs are lowest and I don’t care what happens to the usa company”.

  10. \If the legislation passes then IBM should just bail out of Vermont and put the jobs elsewhere.\

    How many Vermont tax payers that never see IBM pay for IBM’s tax breaks? How many vermonters that work at IBM on a part time basis, have to use Catamount, vhap, or other state programs because IBM does not provide them health insurance, yet does not pay for them, but expects us too? That’s the real IBM. They will probably go somewhere else when they finish milking the state dry; health care is not going to force them out. That’s the way big business works now.

  11. @John Decker”"If the legislation passes then IBM should just bail out of Vermont and put the jobs elsewhere.”"

    Sure. Let IBM move to The Netherlands or Germany where the laws would require IBM employees be paid higher wages and have universal health insurance. American is the land of corporatism, where profit is the bottom line and the workers be damned – no wonder so much of American society is dysfunctional. This is what the Swedish Ikea company took advantage of in Danville, Virginia. They wouldn’t dare treat their employees like that in Europe. Put any foreign company with a good reputation for treating its employees fairly into the corrupt and greedy American business environment and they go to the dark side. Apologists like Jamal Kheiry ultimately believe more in government by corporation than by a true democracy. They say they don’t but they do.

    1. Mr. Carax,

      You don’t know me from Adam, and yet you feel no compunction about ascribing base motives to me simply because I believe differently than you do. That strikes me as a fundamentally dishonest approach.

  12. Dear mr. Davis.
    With astonishment I read your article where you are blaming IBM that they do not want to put a part of their profit into your health care system in Vermont. It is completely understandable that IBM is not doing it. In your text you are raising one of the points yourself by telling that the present IBM health care is better than the present one in Vermont. When you look at the profit that the majority is coming from outside the US. Give me one reason why workers of IBM who life and work outside the US (Europe, Asia Passific, South America and Africa) pay for the people in Vermont. Did the people in Vermont ever paid for the poor in the third world? Every private company will do the same as IBM. It is a positive act of IBM.

  13. Vermont and other states need to do a review of IBM’s employment history. I can
    not think of one state that IBM has not “been pulling out of” for the past 10
    years!! A implied threat of pulling out is worthless in that IBM has already
    been pulling out for cheaper labor markets abroad. Each of the States needs to
    make decisions that are in their citizens best interest and only value the input
    from companies that have demonstrated an ongoing and recent historical growing
    commitment to the state not one like IBM that has been pulling out over the past
    10 years through out the USA ( Except for IOWA )..

  14. Did IBM town, Burlington Vermont ever let the country’s largest private employer, Wal-Mart put stores in their town? I heard they had two stores in the whole state. What’s up with that?

    Last time I was in Burlington, the McDs had no drive-up window. I viewed it as a left-wing conspiracy to prevent cars from idling.

    Oh well, only spent 3 days in the state.

  15. Mr. Carax, IBM-Vermont needn’t move to Europe. It can move to any of several states in the southern US.

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