Montpelier 5/22/2012
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  1. “The partnership also criticizes the plan for ignoring the possibility of the Vermont Yankee Nuclear Power Station continuing offering reliable, cheap energy.”

    Power from VY, after March of 2012, was never going to be cheap. VEP has continually tried to convince Vermonters that the price being paid today for power from VY will be tomorrow’s price and that’s just not true.

    The utilities know this, because they were able to find less expensive power, over the long-term, from other sources.

    The other remarkable aspect of this position ignores the fact that nuclear power, in general, is the most highly subsidized power we have. In addition to the subsidized costs, the cost of decommissioning this plant will, in all likelihood, exceed a billion dollars.

    If VEP and AIV choose to look at just the rate being paid for VY power than they, too, should say no. If they would look at all of the hidden costs of VY power then, like most Vermonters, they would want nothing to do with VY power.

    Then again if the largest member of VEP happens to be Entergy, then this group might see things differently.

  2. “Their main grievance: The plan focuses on climate change, renewable energy, and efficiency to such an extent that they have become goals in and of themselves.”

    That’s a grievance? Really? Tell that to your grandkids when you’re on the way out on your death bed.

    Sounds to me like I might be able to say “Hey kids, at least we finally got around to starting what you’re perfecting. Love ya.”

  3. Schneider’s point is well taken.
    The idea that current economic considerations trump the need to have a livable planet is absurd.

    Johanna Miller is right when she says that there is a false premise that the environment and the economy are at odds when it comes to energy policy and that cleaner energy will create jobs and help the environment.

    Environmental protection and clean, renewable energy are not bad for business. They may be bad for “business as usual”. To say otherwise is extremely short-sighted.

  4. With all the money and addiction to our present comfort level involved, it is very difficult to discern the truth.

  5. Comments from Guy to Rama, Bob and Alan -

    Rama, one of the points I make in our critique of Com. Miller’s plan is that in real terms we will be going backwards, fast, on greenhouse gas emissions. This plan talks the talk but doesn’t walk the walk, and what I mean by that is this: if you close the virtually zero-carbon source of a third of Vermont’s power, and then replace it with natural gas (the short-term plan “until we get enough renewables” in real-time, whenever that is), you (as a state) are going backwards, fast. The climate doesn’t care about our white papers or good intentions, it cares about carbon output. You are either going forward, or backward. This plan takes us backward. I continue to be amazed that no-one in the environmental community seems to be making this an issue. As someone who grew up in Burlington in the Moran Plant era and who hiked acid-rain barren Green Mountain ridgelines, and thought “this really sucks”, it bothers me and I am not going to just stand by and say “oh all right” to the negative environmental impacts of this plan.

    As far as price is concerned – yep, we’re going backward there, too. Alan, I spent a long time looking at that .02 kilowatt figure, at its basis and reasoning, and I’m sorry but I just can’t make that work with any confidence. It looks like a number that is tossed out there in the general report, citing a study that, upon close examination, does not appear to be either clear or well-supported. If you can demonstrate otherwise, I’m all ears. According to my rough arithmetic, if adding a mere 100 MW at 24 cents adds $175 million to ratepayer costs, that’s about two-thirds of that $292 million, right there. And we haven’t even factored in the cost of the other 92% of so of the power the plan projects we need, nor the cost of efficiency.

    Bob, I use what we’re paying VY as a starting point, because that is, well, what we are paying VY. It’s a real-time number. Having said that, even if four cents “skyrockets” all the way up to, say, six cents – that awful 50% increase – in terms of purchase cost isn’t that still a pretty good deal, esp. when the jobs, revenue etc. is factored into the total package. As far as subsidy comparisons go – well, I am no scholar in the field, but it seems to me that subsidizing 24-30 cent power compared with not subsidizing 4-6 cent power is a pretty easy decision from the ratepayer pov.

    Anyway guys, good talking with you, and see you around.

  6. Cheap and reliable? How can they say that with a straight face? At least they’ve given up on the “safe and clean” part. Onward Vermont!!!

  7. Instead of the politically-motivated Public Service Board or the Department of Public Service which has political appointees, doing or supervising the calculations, it is best to select a panel of qualified, independent energy system specialists to do or to supervise the calculations of various alternatives.

    All assumptions should be stated and approved by the panel.

    Glasnost should prevail.

    This procedure will take most of the distrust out of energy policy issues.

  8. Not one mention of conservation. All about cheap. Let us waste together. Run the lights all night. Don’t ask me to think, I just cannot look back. Hey, I might turn into a pillar of snot.

  9. Willem – the PSB members are appointed by the governor, but cannot be removed, thus making them a quasi-judicial board; not a political board.

    I believe that the DPS under former Gov. Douglas could’ve been viewed as being politically motivated. Remember when this governor had an opportunity to buy five dams on the Ct. & Deerfield Rivers for next to nothing? These hydro dams would have more than replaced the power from VY, which was scheduled to close in just a few short years. That governor passed up this extraordinary good deal and allowed
    TransCanada to buy them. Don’t try to convince anyone that this wasn’t political.

    Of course the agencies are political by their nature. The current DPS is in line with the wishes of its boss, just like the last DPS was in line with the wishes of its boss. So what?

  10. Bob,
    Decisions are made without serious analysis by independent energy systems analysts which will significantly increase the energy costs of Vermont households and the cost of goods and services produced with this higher cost energy.

    It will lower the revenues and profits of businesses.
    Households that already are on the margin, say about 30% of Vermont households, will suffer the most.

    If subsidized wind energy with a levelized cost of 9 to 10 c/kWh (per GMP) is rolled in large blocks into the rate schedule it will have an effect.

    The cost seen by the US economy (includes the Vermont economy) is defined as the economic cost without subsidies, which would be 13 to 15 c/kWh on New England ridge lines, PLUS the hidden (not quantified) cost of environmental damage.

  11. “About 50 percent of Vermont’s electricity comes from renewable resources currently, according to a study by the Clean Energy States Alliance. This comes primarily from Hydro-Quebéc and the New York Power Authority.”

    That’s only through the false magic of Vermont yesterday considering HQ to be an environmental disaster and politically unacceptable and today declaring it to be “renewable.” And that’s because the Shumlin Administration needed to come up with something “renewable” to replace VY power, fast.

    It’s a pathetic con job. Either HQ power was always renewable, or it wasn’t and still isn’t.

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